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He writes:
The first state visit ever to Israel by an Indian prime minister – Narendra Modi – could generate the impetus President Trump needs to end the diplomatic void caused by the breakdown in negotiations between Israel and the PLO since 2014.
The obvious warmth, mutual admiration and friendship shared by Modi and Israel’s Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu was clearly evident – contrasting with the hostility, acrimony and venom shown to Israel that has become the norm at the United Nations, UNESCO and UNHRC.
Israel has historically had a long love affair with India’s Vedanta Movement (also known as the Ramakrishna Movement) – a worldwide spiritual movement headquartered near Kolkota in West Bengal.
Vedanta wishes and prays for the well-being, happiness and enlightenment of all the people of the world.
Writing on Modi’s visit, Khinvraj Jangid pointed out that Israel’s first Prime Minister David Ben-Gurion:
'… wrote, in September 1957, to Dr. Indra Sen (of the Aurobindo Ashram) praising the distinctive Indian approach to religion: "From Buddhism I have learned much about the history of religion and philosophy in India in general – and after I was enchanted by the Vedanta I began the study of the schools of Sankhya and Yoga. In his bedroom in the Negev kibbutz of Sde Boker, there was only one leader’s portrait: Gandhi’s.”'Modi himself reportedly attended a comprehensive course studying Vedanta.
“It is generally not known that the East Bank [of the Jordan River – ed] was a part of ancient Palestine and when Britain obtained the Mandate for Palestine, the League of Nations included it in Palestine”Swami Avyaktananda quoted as his sources:
· Two maps in the 14th edition of Encyclopaedia Britannica (1929)
· J.F. Horrabin’s map on page 64 of The Life of Jesus by Conrad Noel (1937) · The map of Palestine on page 18 of “A Short History of the Hebrews” by B.K. Rattey (1931)
· 2 Sam iiThe Swami continued:
'The major portion of Jordan today is really East Palestine, the country on the other side of the Jordan being West Palestine. The handing-over of the territory east of the Jordan River to the Emir Abdullah was, to all intents and purposes, the first partition of Palestine [in 1946 – ed.]through which a large portion of Palestine [78% - ed.] went to Arab hands. This partition was not considered when the United Nations framed the Plan of partition of Palestine into Jewish Palestine and Arab Palestine [in 1947 – ed.].
If the Palestine Liberation Organisation accepts the historical facts presented here, considers sympathetically the Jewish aspirations and struggle for the National Home, National Language and National Culture for about 2000 years, and agrees to rethink the problems of the Middle East with goodwill and understanding then the problem of the Middle East will be solved without difficulty. The whole of ancient Palestine will be shared by Jews and Arabs through an amicable settlement if the Palestinian National Home is established in the East Bank of the Jordan. It can be called “New Palestine” and this naming will be quite correct.'The PLO, Jordan and Israel can cooperatively implement the Vedanta Solution – extended to incorporate the allocation of sovereignty in Judea and Samaria (West Bank) between Jordan and Israel – or Jordan and Israel can so act jointly if the PLO refuses to participate.
Embracing the two-State Vedanta Solution – with Modi as a possible interlocutor – could be the Trojan Horse President Trump needs to broker a deal to end the Arab-Jewish conflict.
[FINAL VERSION]
ReplyDelete"The PLO, Jordan and Israel can cooperatively implement the Vedanta Solution – extended to incorporate the allocation of sovereignty in Judea and Samaria (West Bank) between Jordan and Israel – or Jordan and Israel can so act jointly if the PLO refuses to participate".
Above, does your so-called Vedanta Solution envisage that we concede a part of the Jewish people's historic land of J&S to the Arabs?
If so, it is extremely scary and troubling to me that you would propose giving up our land, which already has been portioned multiple times, either to "Palestinian" Arabs or Hashemite Arabs, both of whom are non-indigenous, unlike us. The latter, which has attacked us multiple times, desecrated our holy sites and made the area judenren while under its illegal occupation (1949-1967).
For Gd-sake, even the Swamy agrees that the partition of Israel (a.k.a. Palestine) already has occurred when Jordan was given the East Bank of Israel.
Why do you constantly insist on giving away more land to our enemies?
Noah
Delete1.The Vedanta Solution is not my solution. It is the solution proposed by the Vedanta Movement.
2.Israeli Governments have been prepared to trade land for peace since accepting the 1993 Oslo Accords.
3. Israel has had a signed peace treaty with Jordan since 1994. People can kiss and make up - and so can States.
4. The Vedanta Solution indeed sought to limit "New Palestine" to the East Bank of the Jordan. 35 years later its proposals - if insisted on by Israel without some acceptable form of territorial compromise between Jordan and Israel in Judea and Samaria - will not be accepted by the Arab world.
5. Whatever claims the Jews had on the East Bank were relinquished by accepting article 25 of the Mandate. Similarly whatever rights the PLO had in Judea and Samaria were relinquished under Article 24 of the PLO Charter 1964. What is good for the goose is good for the gander.
David,
ReplyDelete1. It is clear that the Vedanta Solution is not yours, but that proposed by the Indian Vedanta Movement. However, in your post above, you clearly embrace and support it!
2. Since Camp David, Israeli governments have been prepared to trade land for peace when peace, albeit cold peace, actually was forthcoming, such as with Egypt & Jordan.
However, it has been clear, at least from the second Intifida (if not long before) that the Arab "Palestinians" are not ever going to be able or willing to deliver peace.
After 30 years of sincere Israeli attempts at peace and countless concessions, they continue to car ram, stab and shoot Jewish Israeli's. Neither Fatah nor Hamas have revised their Charters. Both governments, especially that of the so-called "moderate" Palestinian Authority continue to name streets and landmarks for Jew killing terrorists, pay imprisoned terrorists and the families of dead terrorists, incite "martyrs" to kill Jews in the name of Gd and indoctrinate children to hate Jews.
Further, the PA, our so-called "peace-partner" is not even capable of making peace given that there still is no real functioning government, economy nor attempt at either. Additionally, there has been no reconciliation with Hamas and clearly it is not forthcoming. Fatah and Hamas remain at war and Fatah continues to leave Gaza in darkness with no electricity (which I agree with).
*It is clear that the majority of Israeli Jews no longer support land for peace nor believe the Arab "Palestinians" can deliver. Clearly, it is time to examine other solutions (e.g. Caroline Glick, Martin Shearman, Ted Bellman, etc.)
3. The Israeli "peace" treaty with Jordan is cold at best. It didn't seem to stop the "Island of Peace" massacre, the release of the terrorist who committed the atrocities (to a hero's welcome) nor the release and harboring of countless other Jew killing terrorists.
Further, the country is radicalized with threats to its sovereignty by ISIS, Al Qaida, Iran and countless other terrorist groups all looking to gain control of the country.
Should any of them succeed to overthrow the Hashemites, our coveted peace treaty with Jordan will be null and void. This is a clear warning to Israel against making peace with volatile Arab regimes in the throws of the Arab spring.
4. Israel needs to act in its own self-interest, not what is acceptable to its Arab detractors which continue to defame and attack it in international forums and deny the Jewish connection to Irael, such as at the UN or UNESCO. More so, in the fight against radical Islam and Iran, these Arabs need Israel significantly more than we need them.
5. Without getting to long winded, title to Transjordan never was permanently relinquished by the Jews. Article 25 only permitted the British a temporary change in status. Howard Grief has written extensively on this.
David,
ReplyDelete1. It is clear that the Vedanta Solution is not yours, but that proposed by the Indian Vedanta Movement. However, in your post above, you clearly embrace and support it!
2. Since Camp David, Israeli governments have been prepared to trade land for peace when peace, albeit cold peace, actually was forthcoming, such as with Egypt & Jordan.
However, it has been clear, at least from the second Intifida (if not long before) that the Arab "Palestinians" are not ever going to be able or willing to deliver peace.
After 30 years of sincere Israeli attempts at peace and countless concessions, they continue to car ram, stab and shoot Jewish Israeli's. Neither Fatah nor Hamas have revised their Charters. Both governments, especially that of the so-called "moderate" Palestinian Authority continue to name streets and landmarks for Jew killing terrorists, pay imprisoned terrorists and the families of dead terrorists, incite "martyrs" to kill Jews in the name of Gd and indoctrinate children to hate Jews.
Further, the PA, our so-called "peace-partner" is not even capable of making peace given that there still is no real functioning government, economy nor attempt at either. Additionally, there has been no reconciliation with Hamas and clearly it is not forthcoming. Fatah and Hamas remain at war and Fatah continues to leave Gaza in darkness with no electricity (which I agree with).
*It is clear that the majority of Israeli Jews no longer support land for peace nor believe the Arab "Palestinians" can deliver. Clearly, it is time to examine other solutions (e.g. Caroline Glick, Martin Shearman, Ted Bellman, etc.)
3. The Israeli "peace" treaty with Jordan is cold at best. It didn't seem to stop the "Island of Peace" massacre, the release of the terrorist who committed the atrocities (to a hero's welcome) nor the release and harboring of countless other Jew killing terrorists.
Further, the country is radicalized with threats to its sovereignty by ISIS, Al Qaida, Iran and countless other terrorist groups all looking to gain control of the country.
Should any of them succeed to overthrow the Hashemites, our coveted peace treaty with Jordan will be null and void. This is a clear warning to Israel against making peace with volatile Arab regimes in the throws of the Arab spring.
4. Israel needs to act in its own self-interest, not what is acceptable to its Arab detractors which continue to defame and attack it in international forums and deny the Jewish connection to Israel, such as at the UN or UNESCO. More so, in the fight against radical Islam and Iran, these Arabs need Israel significantly more than we need them.
5. Without getting to long winded, title to Trans Jordan never was permanently relinquished by the Jews. Article 25 only permitted the British a temporary change in status. Howard Grief has written extensively on this.
[CORRECTION]
ReplyDeleteDavid,
1. It is clear that the Vedanta Solution is not yours, but that proposed by the Indian Vedanta Movement. However, in your post above, you clearly embrace and support it!
2. Since Camp David, Israeli governments have been prepared to trade land for peace when peace, albeit cold peace, actually was forthcoming, such as with Egypt & Jordan.
However, it has been clear, at least from the second Intifida (if not long before) that the Arab "Palestinians" are not ever going to be able or willing to deliver peace.
After 30 years of sincere Israeli attempts at peace and countless concessions, they continue to car ram, stab and shoot Jewish Israeli's. Neither Fatah nor Hamas have revised their Charters. Both governments, especially that of the so-called "moderate" Palestinian Authority continue to name streets and landmarks for Jew killing terrorists, pay imprisoned terrorists and the families of dead terrorists, incite "martyrs" to kill Jews in the name of Gd and indoctrinate children to hate Jews.
Further, the PA, our so-called "peace-partner" is not even capable of making peace given that there still is no real functioning government, economy nor attempt at either. Additionally, there has been no reconciliation with Hamas and clearly it is not forthcoming. Fatah and Hamas remain at war and Fatah continues to leave Gaza in darkness with no electricity (which I agree with).
*It is clear that the majority of Israeli Jews no longer support land for peace nor believe the Arab "Palestinians" can deliver. Clearly, it is time to examine other solutions (e.g. Caroline Glick, Martin Shearman, Ted Bellman, etc.)
3. The Israeli "peace" treaty with Jordan is cold at best. It didn't seem to stop the "Island of Peace" massacre, the release of the terrorist who committed the atrocities (to a hero's welcome) nor the release and harboring of countless other Jew killing terrorists.
Further, the country is radicalized with threats to its sovereignty by ISIS, Al Qaida, Iran and countless other terrorist groups all looking to gain control of the country.
Should any of them succeed to overthrow the Hashemites, our coveted peace treaty with Jordan will be null and void. This is a clear warning to Israel against making peace with volatile Arab regimes, such as the PA, in the throws of the Arab spring.
4. Israel needs to act in its own self-interest, not what is acceptable to its Arab detractors which continue to defame and attack it in international forums and deny the Jewish connection to Irael, such as at the UN or UNESCO. More so, in the fight against radical Islam and Iran, these Arabs need Israel significantly more than we need them.
5. Without getting to long winded, title to Transjordan never was permanently relinquished by the Jews. Article 25 only permitted the British a temporary change in status. Howard Grief has written extensively on this.
Two supplemental pieces of info which coincidentally came out today:
ReplyDelete1. Failed 2-state Solution.
Earlier in the day, Yisrael Beytenu party chairman and Defense Minister Avigdor Liberman called on the Trump administration to change course in its peacemaking style, and abandon the failing bilateral approach.
Speaking at the weekly faction meeting, Liberman pointed out that numerous governments have tried – and failed – to make peace between Israel and the Palestinian Authority since the 1993 signing of the Oslo Accords. The Ramallah government refused all attempts, regardless of who made the effort, and regardless of what was contained in the plan.
2. Article by Mudar Zahran the Jordanian Palestinian writer and the secretary general of the Jordanian Opposition Coalition.
In the article, he states that "Jordan’s regime’s alliance with the MB is deeper than generally realized" and details its very close relationship w/ the Muslim Brotherhood and thus Qatar.
In fact, he states that "while the king [of Jordan] bans secularists and liberals for a mere tweet, the MB owns its licensed satellite TV network and daily paper in which they consistently preach terrorism and death to America and the Jews".
So much for your highly coveted peace with Jordan!!
In response to your numbered comments:
Delete1. The two-state solution involving the creation of a second Arab State - in addition to Jordan - in the territory comprised in the Mandate - has been an abysmal failure. It was doomed to failure since it was dreamed up by George Bush and the Quartet in 2002. I have consistently maintained that view in scores of articles published since then.
The Palestinian Authority no longer exists. It was disbanded on 3 January 2013.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/john-v-whitbeck/the-state-of-palestine-ex_b_2431690.html
Why anyone in Israel still uses that term is a real mystery.
2. You cannot run away from the fact that Jordan and Israel have maintained a signed peace agreement since 1994 that has withstood many events that could easily have railroaded it. Zahran is entitled to his opinion, you to yours and me to mine. Time will show whose analysis is correct.
It is good manners to cite the link to any articles you quote from. Could you please do so with the Zahran article you are referring to.
****************************************************
You have posted three other very similar responses for the second time to this article which you should surely find embarrassing. I do not intend to deal with any of these comments until you indicate which one of the three you want a reply to.
Can you please try and avoid this practice. You have done it previously and I would suggest you try and get what you want to say right the first time.
In response....
Delete1. Based on all of your previous postings and our discussions, I find it hard to believe that you do not support the creation of another Arab state(s) in "the territory comprised in the Mandate".
Even if I am to take you at your word, clearly you still support ceeding very strategically valuable land to Jordan thru the "allocation of sovereignty in Judea and Samaria (West Bank) between Jordan and Israel under the two-State Vedanta Solution – with Modi as a possible interlocutor".
As a side note, despite recognition by the UN General Assembly as an "Observer State", only a positive vote by the UN Security Council vote could confer statehood on the PA. Even that would be highly dubiious as the Palestinian entity fails to satisfy the traditional legal criteria for statehood, such as effective and independent governmental control of a clearly defined territory & a permanent population, none of which exists.
Additionally, both a unilateral declaration of statehood by the PA and/or conference of statehood by the by UN is a breach of the 1995 Israeli-Palestinian agreement on the status of the West Bank and the Gaza Strip pending a final peace accord.
2. As I stated above, the "peace" treaty with Jordan is cold at best.
Further, with Jordan already radicalized to the brink and with threats to its sovereignty by ISIS, Al Qaida, Iran and countless other terrorist groups why should or would Israel want to ceede it more land. Especially, land with such enormous strategic value. J&S is critical to defending against attack from the east as it provides at least a minimum amount of stratetic depth and defensible borders.
Amidst the volatile Arab "Spring" no peace treaty with any Arab entity (let alone the ceeding of land to such entity) would be worth the paper on which it is written. Why take such a risk?
3. I provided you the name of the author, date of publication and topic. With your skills, finding it should be easy.
Appologize for the multiple posts, but I keep modifying tidbits here and there. Will try to keep the numbe of posts at a minimum.
Noah
ReplyDeleteI am always suspicious of persons like you who make this kind of comment:
"I provided you the name of the author, date of publication and topic. With your skills, finding it should be easy."
Such a comment indicates that the person making it has something to hide and is being less than frank - hoping that the person to whom it is made will not track down the source.
So I went to the source and found what Zahran said in the paragraph before and the paragraph after the one sentence you "quote":
http://www.jewishpress.com/indepth/opinions/what-you-do-not-know-about-the-qatar-crisis/2017/07/10/
"Some may be perplexed by the claim that Jordan’s regime supports the MB. Jordan and Qatar both provide support for the MB. Jordan’s royal family, the Hashemites, have been in a full alliance with MB since the 1950s. The MB were the ones who supported the kingdom’s founder, Emir Abdallah, in annexing the West Bank. They also stood with the Hashemites in 1970 during their civil war with the PLO. This fact has been confirmed by Jordan’s king himself in a 2013 interview with The Atlantic magazine.
Further, Jordan’s regime’s alliance with the MB is deeper than generally realized.
In November 2012, Jordan witnessed the largest Arab Spring-style revolution. One million took to the street demanding that the king steps down. Despite overwhelming popular sentiment, the MB openly stood against the revolution and said: “We will never allow the king to fall.” While the MB is banned in most Arab countries, in Jordan, they are registered as a charity, a political organization, and a private business. While the king bans secularists and liberals for a mere tweet, the MB owns its licensed satellite TV network and daily paper in which they consistently preach terrorism and death to America and the Jews."
David,
DeleteYour post from the article merely confirms what I said.
However, I am always suspicious of people like you who:
1. Constantly deflect and change topics when proven to be incredibly wrong. For example, your response above which completely avoids responding to my points proving you support giving very strategic land to Jordan and our enemies. This is not the first time you have deflected; and
2. Make inaccurate statements using questionable sources. For example your claim that the PA has been dissolved and has become the state of Palestine.
Based on your above response which completely avoids responding to my points, should I assume you concede them?
David,
DeleteYour post from the article merely confirms what I said.
However, I am always suspicious of people like you who:
1. Constantly deflect and change topics when proven to be incredibly wrong or bordering on the insane. For example, your response above completely avoids responding to my points proving you support giving very strategic land to Jordan and our enemies.
This is not the first time you have deflected; and
2. Make incredibly inaccurate statements using questionable sources.
For example, your claim that the PA has been dissolved and has become the state of Palestine (because as your article says the UNGA approved it and Abbas said it was the case!).
Certainly, as an "international lawyer" you must understand how that can't be accurate (I laid it out for you above).
Based on your above response which completely avoids responding to my points, should I assume you concede them?
*I violated my promise not to reply twice but I am in the middle of meetings and don't want to leave anything out.
David,
ReplyDeleteAs I appreciate you educating me in a previous post on proper BLOG etiquette and limiting similar posts, I would like to return the favor.
As such, I have two suggestions that you may or may not wish to follow. Firstly, I would suggest that you think carefully before posting as to actually what you wish to convey in your post. I say this because I truly don't believe that you believe Israel conceding land in J&S to Jordan is good for the country in any circumstance.
Secondly, I think you embarrass yourself with inaccurate and misleading statements such as that the UNGA vote and the PA's declaration are sufficient to confer statehood on the PA. I am not an "international lawyer" like you, but this sort of information is readily available on the internet and a high-schooler could figure it out.
However, I do appreciate your blogs as they serve as a way for me to refresh my knowledge of the situation in Israel and as a means to reinforce my beliefs in the right solution.
Clearly, the solution is not the that of the Indian Swami nor your modification of it, both which would cede more of the Jewish peoples Gd given land and security to Jordan, which is an anti-Jewish radicalized Islamist country teetering on the brink of destruction.
David,
ReplyDeleteYour post from the article merely confirms what I said.
However, I am always suspicious of people like you who:
1. Constantly deflect and change topics when proven to be incredibly wrong. For example, your response above which completely avoids responding to my points proving you support giving very strategic land to Jordan and our enemies. This is not the first time you have deflected; and
2. Make inaccurate statements using questionable sources. For example your claim that the PA has been dissolved and has become the state of Palestine.
Based on your above response which completely avoids responding to my points, should I assume you concede them?
Noah
ReplyDeleteYou make the following unsubstantiated claims:
1. “Based on all of your previous postings and our discussions, I find it hard to believe that you do not support the creation of another Arab state(s) in "the territory comprised in the Mandate".
A totally baseless and highly offensive comment.
You can read 462 of my published articles at the following link which refute your irrational claim:
http://jordanispalestine.blogspot.com.au/
Please try and base your comments on fact not fantasy.
2. “Even if I am to take you at your word, clearly you still support ceeding (sic) very strategically valuable land to Jordan”
“your response above completely avoids responding to my points proving you support giving very strategic land to Jordan and our enemies.”
Where have I ever said that? Putting words in my mouth that I never have uttered is absolutely disgraceful. Israel will decide what is “strategically valuable land” in Judea and Samaria and will certainly not cede these areas to Jordan.
3. “Make inaccurate statements using questionable sources. For example your claim that the PA has been dissolved and has become the state of Palestine.”
“Make incredibly inaccurate statements using questionable sources.
For example, your claim that the PA has been dissolved and has become the state of Palestine (because as your article says the UNGA approved it and Abbas said it was the case!).”
I did not make either of the above claims you dishonestly and reprehensibly allege and misrepresent.
This is what I actually said:
“The Palestinian Authority no longer exists. It was disbanded on 3 January 2013.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/john-v-whitbeck/the-state-of-palestine-ex_b_2431690.html”
Again you try to put words into my mouth that I never uttered.
This was intended to be a polite reminder to you that the terms “PA” or “Palestinian Authority” should not be used any longer because that body was disbanded on 3 January 2013.
You used those terms three times in one post.
The term you should use in the future is “the Palestine Liberation Organisation”.
My reply to some of your replies IN CAPITAL LETTERS for clarity.
ReplyDelete1. You state:
“Even if I am to take you at your word, clearly you still support ceeding (sic) very strategically valuable land to Jordan”
“your response above completely avoids responding to my points proving you support giving very strategic land to Jordan and our enemies.”
"Where have I ever said that? Putting words in my mouth that I never have uttered is absolutely disgraceful. Israel will decide what is “strategically valuable land” in Judea and Samaria and will certainly not cede these areas to Jordan".
My Reply:
CLEARLY, YOU CALL FOR AND SUPPORT A MODIFICATION OF THE SWAMI'S "VEDANTA SOLUTION" TO INCLUDE PARTS OF J&S, WOULD CEDE VALUABLE ISRAELI LAND JORDAN IRRESPECTIVE OF WHERE IN J&S.
IN YOUR POST, YOU STATE:
"The PLO, Jordan and Israel can cooperatively implement the Vedanta Solution – extended to incorporate the allocation of sovereignty in Judea and Samaria (West Bank) between Jordan and Israel – or Jordan and Israel can so act jointly if the PLO refuses to participate.
"Embracing the two-State Vedanta Solution – with Modi as a possible interlocutor – could be the Trojan Horse President Trump needs to broker a deal to end the Arab-Jewish conflict".
IN MY OPINION AND THAT OF COUNTLESS EXPERTS, INCLUDING:
- KHALED ABU TOMEAH OF GATESTONE
- CAROLINE GLICK
- MOSHE FEIGLIN
- MARTIN SHERMAN,
TO NAME A FEW, TO ENSURE ITS SURVIVAL ISRAEL CANNOT CEDE LAND TO JORDAN.
AS I STATED NUMEROUS TIMES ABOVE, ANY CEDING OF LAND TO JORDAN WILL STRATEGICALLY COMPRISES ISRAEL AND ITS SECURITY. NOT ONLY BECAUSE IT REDUCES WHAT LITTLE STRATEGIC DEPTH & DEFENSIBLE BORDERS WE HAVE, BUT BECAUSE THE PEACE WITH JORDAN IS FRAGILE AND JORDAN REMAINS A RADICALIZED COUNTRY IN JEOPARDY OF LOSING ITS SOVEREIGNTY TO ISLAMISTS.
YOUR SWAMI VEDANTA PROPOSAL WOULD BRING RADICAL ISLAMISTS LIKE HAMAS & ISIS CLOSER TO TEL AVIV AND ISRAELS CENTER.
EVEN AL MONITOR AND MOST JORDANIANS ARE AGAINST SUCH A SOLUTION.
2. You state:
“Make inaccurate statements using questionable sources. For example your claim that the PA has been dissolved and has become the state of Palestine.”
“Make incredibly inaccurate statements using questionable sources".
"For example, your claim that the PA has been dissolved and has become the state of Palestine (because as your article says the UNGA approved it and Abbas said it was the case!).”
"I did not make either of the above claims you dishonestly and reprehensibly allege and misrepresent".
My reply:
IT IS CLEAR THAT YOUR MERE MENTION OF THE PALESTINIAN DECLARATION OF STATEHOOD AND THUS CHANGE OF NAME TO THE STATE OF PALESTINE IS ANOTHER ATTEMPT AT DEFLECTING FROM THE REAL DEBATE, WHICH IS YOUR RIDICULOUS SWAMI PROPOSAL TO CEDE MORE OF OUR LAND TO JORDAN.
HOWEVER, I HAVE COME TO EXPECT DEFLECTION FROM YOU.
NONE-THE-LESS, I WILL ADDRESS IT YET AGAIN.
IN ADDITION TO MY PREVIOUS ARGUMENTS ABOVE, WHICH ARE BASED IN INTERNATIONAL LAW, BELOW I HAVE ATTACHED [TO SAVE YOU THE TROUBLE OF SEARCHING] A LINK TO THE DEC. 2016 CONGRESSIONAL RESEARCH REPORT ON "US AID TO THE PALESTINIANS". THIS REPORT WAS PUBLISHED LONG AFTER ABBAS AND THE UN ILLEGALLY DECLARED THE STATE OF PALESTINE.
https://fas.org/sgp/crs/mideast/RS22967.pdf
IN THE REPORT, THE AUTHOR REFERS TO THE PALESTINIAN GOVERNMENT AS THE "PALESTINIAN AUTHORITY" OR "PA".
BELOW IS A RANDOM LIST OF SOME OTHER GOVERNMENTAL WEBSITES THAT I FOUND QUICKLY ALSO WHICH STILL REFER TO THE "PA".
PALESTINIAN MISSION TO DENMARK
http://palestine.dk/palestine/government/
PNA STATE INFORMATION SITE
https://web.archive.org/web/20030811082848/http://www.sis.gov.ps/english/index.html
I do not intend to reply to your last posted comments (13 July 2017 at 18.51) until you unconditionally and unreservedly withdraw these following comments made by you in earlier posts:
ReplyDelete1. “Based on all of your previous postings and our discussions, I find it hard to believe that you do not support the creation of another Arab state(s) in "the territory comprised in the Mandate".
2. “Even if I am to take you at your word, clearly you still support ceeding (sic) very strategically valuable land to Jordan”
3. “your response above completely avoids responding to my points proving you support giving very strategic land to Jordan and our enemies.”
4. “Make inaccurate statements using questionable sources. For example your claim that the PA has been dissolved and has become the state of Palestine.”
5. “Make incredibly inaccurate statements using questionable sources.
For example, your claim that the PA has been dissolved and has become the state of Palestine (because as your article says the UNGA approved it and Abbas said it was the case!).”
When you unconditionally and unreservedly withdraw your above comments I will respond to your latest post.
I didn't think you would reply.
ReplyDeleteI only ecpected more deflection.
The bottom line is you support giving our land to Jordan.
Statements like that are careless and reckless, especially whn you are basing it on some 100 year old Swami.
Why would I withdraw any of those points when in fact they are true?
ReplyDeleteAnyway, your last posted comments (14 July 2017 at 08.08) are just another attempt at avoiding having to address my points. I call it DEFLECTION!
Clearly, if you had an answer to my last posted comments (13 July 2017 at 18.51) you would not hessitate to respond.
The bottom line is that your modified Swami Proposal not well thoughtout nor well conceived, is wreckless and dangerous and shows a complete lack of understanding as to the actual situation in Israel.
To reiterate, Jordan is no friend of Israel, supports and harbors radical islamists and terrorists w/ Jewish blood on their hands and can barely defend its sovereignty. That you propose not only to cede them more of our land, but land with great strategic importance, is scarry.
However, I assume writting from the comfort and safety of your armchair in Australia affords you that luxury.
So, in case the above is not clear, in no way do I withdraw my previous statements (13 July 2017 at 18.51). In fact, you should admit the error of your proposal and your support for a another (maybe 2) Arab terrorist states on Israel's border.
David,
ReplyDeleteHERE is another prefect example of why nothing should be given to Jordan.
(http://www.jewishpress.com/news/israel/jerusalem/terror-attack-at-jerusalems-lions-gate/2017/07/14/)
"Breaking News: Terror Attack on Temple Mount, 2 Border Policemen Critically Wounded, 2 More Wounded"
Noah
DeleteI do not intend to reply to your last four posted comments until you unconditionally and unreservedly withdraw these following comments made by you in earlier posts (1 to 5) and in your post of 14 July at 13.51 (6 and 7):
1. “Based on all of your previous postings and our discussions, I find it hard to believe that you do not support the creation of another Arab state(s) in "the territory comprised in the Mandate".
2. “Even if I am to take you at your word, clearly you still support ceeding (sic) very strategically valuable land to Jordan”
3. “your response above completely avoids responding to my points proving you support giving very strategic land to Jordan and our enemies.”
4. “Make inaccurate statements using questionable sources. For example your claim that the PA has been dissolved and has become the state of Palestine.”
5. “Make incredibly inaccurate statements using questionable sources.
For example, your claim that the PA has been dissolved and has become the state of Palestine (because as your article says the UNGA approved it and Abbas said it was the case!).”
6. "Why would I withdraw any of those points when in fact they are true?
Anyway, your last posted comments (14 July 2017 at 08.08) are just another attempt at avoiding having to address my points. I call it DEFLECTION!"
7. "So, in case the above is not clear, in no way do I withdraw my previous statements (13 July 2017 at 18.51)."
When you unconditionally and unreservedly withdraw your above comments I will respond to your your four last posts.
ReplyDeleteNoah
You really have a problem.
You continue to assert:
“My statements are true and I NEVER will retract them.”
Yet you already have retracted two the seven statements to which I took strong exception:
1. “Even if I am to take you at your word, clearly you still support ceeding (sic) very strategically valuable land to Jordan”
2. “your response above completely avoids responding to my points proving you support giving very strategic land to Jordan and our enemies.”
In your reply dated 13 July at 18.51 you state:
“CLEARLY, YOU CALL FOR AND SUPPORT A MODIFICATION OF THE SWAMI'S "VEDANTA SOLUTION" TO INCLUDE PARTS OF J&S, WOULD CEDE VALUABLE ISRAELI LAND JORDAN IRRESPECTIVE OF WHERE IN J&S.”
Clearly “valuable Israeli land” is not the same as “very strategically valuable land”.
This was your first concession.
Then in your reply dated 14 July at 18.54 you state:
“The bottom line is you support giving our land to Jordan.”
Clearly “our land” has a different meaning to “very strategically valuable land” or “valuable Israeli land”
You see Noah – language is very important – especially where the Jewish-Arab conflict is concerned.
You have changed tack three times in regard to the above two offending allegations you continue to make against me – which stubbornly you continue to maintain are true.
I repeat – until you unconditionally and unreservedly withdraw all seven statements to which I have taken exception, I do not intend to respond to your posts. When you do I will respond.
I have now made that offer three times.
David,
ReplyDeleteLet me rephrase lest there be no confusion.
Once again, you play on semantics to hide the fact that YOU SUPPORT CEDING VERY VERY STRATEGICALLY SIGNIFICANT land to Jordan under the "Modified Swami" proposal and/or to the Arab "Palestinians" under a 2-state solution..
I am writing to you in between meetings, flights, etc., so please excuse me if the wording changes.
To be clear, "very strategically valuable land" and/or "valuable Israeli land" means the same thing. Both of my phrases refer to any land in J&S (or Israel for that matter), portions of which you would cede and which I would not.
You continue to hide behind semantics and to deflect from your ridiculous proposals.
However, your willingness to cede our land to our enemies is clear to the reader.
Noah
ReplyDeleteDear me – now a fourth term is introduced by you:
“ VERY VERY STRATEGICALLY SIGNIFICANT land”
You offer this pathetic excuse:
“I am writing to you in between meetings, flights, etc., so please excuse me if the wording changes”
No I won’t excuse you.
With your latest posts also come the following comment which I find offensive and ask you to unconditionally and unreservedly withdraw along with the seven I have previously asked you to do:
“Your veiled offer to respond should I retract statements I made which reflect truths regarding your eagerness to give our land to our enemies is worthless.”
For the record – here are the eight statements made by you to be unconditionally and unreservedly withdrawn:
1. “Based on all of your previous postings and our discussions, I find it hard to believe that you do not support the creation of another Arab state(s) in "the territory comprised in the Mandate".
2. “Even if I am to take you at your word, clearly you still support ceeding (sic) very strategically valuable land to Jordan”
3. “your response above completely avoids responding to my points proving you support giving very strategic land to Jordan and our enemies.”
4. “Make inaccurate statements using questionable sources. For example your claim that the PA has been dissolved and has become the state of Palestine.”
5. “Make incredibly inaccurate statements using questionable sources.
For example, your claim that the PA has been dissolved and has become the state of Palestine (because as your article says the UNGA approved it and Abbas said it was the case!).”
6. "Why would I withdraw any of those points when in fact they are true?
Anyway, your last posted comments (14 July 2017 at 08.08) are just another attempt at avoiding having to address my points. I call it DEFLECTION!"
7. "So, in case the above is not clear, in no way do I withdraw my previous statements."
8. “Your veiled offer to respond should I retract statements I made which reflect truths regarding your eagerness to give our land to our enemies is worthless.”
Hope you can find the time between your meetings, flights etc to realise what a complete fool you are making of yourself.
David,
ReplyDeleteIt is clear beyond a shadow of a doubt by your numerous replies and by your posts that you have no counter to my accusations and can only attempt to deflect.
Unfortunately, for you, Daphne's readers likely are too intelligent for your pathetic attempt to avoid responsibility for your aggregious proposals. Several of the worst such proposals (and quite funny too) are listed below:
1. The "Modified Swami" proposal whereby Israel would give some of its land to Jordan. Aside from the enormous strategic importance of said land to Israel and its security and the risks posed by giving it to Jordan as I have outlined above, it is obvious to anyone with the ability to read a periodical that Jordan NEVER would accept such a proposal.
2. 2-State Solution. Again, this has proved futile to all but the most recalcitrant and/or ignorant believers. Not only is it a capitulation of the Jewish peoples Gd given right to Israel and a major security risk, but the PA (yes, the PA as it is called) has proven unwilling and incapable of accepting it.
Maybe, your next post will have a more creative proposal, like the Alien Proposal or maybe Jesus will return with a solution?
In either case, I look forward to another good laugh when reading it. While inane, your posts always entertain!
BY THE WAY, not only are you a deflector, you are a great contradiction. You continue to contradict yourself, which may be why your posts are so wacky.
Despite your fourth refusal to respond to me until I retract the above eight statements highlighting the inanities of your posts, your last post looks very much like another reply (to me).
Noah
ReplyDeleteFor the record – I again repeat there are eight statements made by you to be unconditionally and unreservedly withdrawn:
1. “Based on all of your previous postings and our discussions, I find it hard to believe that you do not support the creation of another Arab state(s) in "the territory comprised in the Mandate".
2. “Even if I am to take you at your word, clearly you still support ceeding (sic) very strategically valuable land to Jordan”
3. “your response above completely avoids responding to my points proving you support giving very strategic land to Jordan and our enemies.”
4. “Make inaccurate statements using questionable sources. For example your claim that the PA has been dissolved and has become the state of Palestine.”
5. “Make incredibly inaccurate statements using questionable sources.
For example, your claim that the PA has been dissolved and has become the state of Palestine (because as your article says the UNGA approved it and Abbas said it was the case!).”
6. "Why would I withdraw any of those points when in fact they are true?
Anyway, your last posted comments (14 July 2017 at 08.08) are just another attempt at avoiding having to address my points. I call it DEFLECTION!"
7. "So, in case the above is not clear, in no way do I withdraw my previous statements."
8. “Your veiled offer to respond should I retract statements I made which reflect truths regarding your eagerness to give our land to our enemies is worthless.”
Until you do I will not be responding to any of your comments in relation to this article or any previous or subsequent articles published under my name.
David,
ReplyDeleteFor someone who refuses to reply, you seem to reply a lot.
The above 8 statements accurately reflect your views and opinions on Israel & its security and your lack of knowledge regarding facts on the ground.
I won't re-address each statement, but a few of your most ridiculous are as follows in no particular order:
1. The PA is now widely called the State of Palestine
2. The "Modified Swami Plan" "could end the Arab-Jewish Conflict".
This is one of your most inane comments as not only will our ceding of our Gd given land show weakness and embolden the Arabs, the "Palestinian" Arabs & our enemies, reduce our strategic depth and borders, but the Kingdom never would accept the return of a significant number of Arab "Palestinians"; and
3. Your embrace of the 2-State solution.
ALL of Daphne's readers understand why this can't succeed. I will not reiterate here.
However, I look forward to your next posting. It should make for a good laugh.
ReplyDeleteNoah
For the record there are now 10 statements made by you to be unconditionally and unreservedly withdrawn:
1. “Based on all of your previous postings and our discussions, I find it hard to believe that you do not support the creation of another Arab state(s) in "the territory comprised in the Mandate".
2. “Even if I am to take you at your word, clearly you still support ceeding (sic) very strategically valuable land to Jordan”
3. “your response above completely avoids responding to my points proving you support giving very strategic land to Jordan and our enemies.”
4. “Make inaccurate statements using questionable sources. For example your claim that the PA has been dissolved and has become the state of Palestine.
5. “Make incredibly inaccurate statements using questionable sources.
For example, your claim that the PA has been dissolved and has become the state of Palestine (because as your article says the UNGA approved it and Abbas said it was the case!).”
6. "Why would I withdraw any of those points when in fact they are true?
Anyway, your last posted comments (14 July 2017 at 08.08) are just another attempt at avoiding having to address my points. I call it DEFLECTION!"
7. "So, in case the above is not clear, in no way do I withdraw my previous statements."
8. “Your veiled offer to respond should I retract statements I made which reflect truths regarding your eagerness to give our land to our enemies is worthless.”
9. “The above 8 statements accurately reflect your views and opinions on Israel & its security and your lack of knowledge regarding facts on the ground.
10. “I won't re-address each statement, but a few of your most ridiculous are as follows in no particular order:
1. The PA is now widely called the State of Palestine”
P.S.
ReplyDeleteRegarding your previous argument that my use of two slightly different phrases implies anything or gives your argument any substance is also inane:
You state:
Clearly “valuable Israeli land” is not the same as “very strategically valuable land”.
Whil;e I argue it is semantics and both phrases are the same, what exactly is your point?
OR do you have point?
I assume you don't and are merely deflecting again.
HERE is more from your Peace Partner Jordan, to whom you propose we give our land under your inane "Modified Swami Plan".
ReplyDelete"Outside Temple Mount, But Peace Reigns Within"
http://www.jewishpress.com/news/eye-on-palestine/palestinian-authority/incitement-whips-up-muslim-rage-outside-temple-mount-but-peace-reigns-within/2017/07/18/
HERE is an excerpt from the article in case you have too much trouble reading the link:
The worshipers are being egged on by incitement from the Palestinian Authority’s leading Fatah faction, Gaza’s ruling Hamas terrorist organization, Jordan’s parliament and its Speaker, Atef Tarawneh, Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan, and other external Muslim forces: all of them linked in one way or another to the Muslim Brotherhood and organized towards the goal of destabilizing the social fabric and peace of Jerusalem and the Temple Mount.
HERE is more from the article:
ReplyDeleteThe Jordanian parliament on Sunday praised the terrorists who murdered two Israeli police officers and wounded others, praying for their souls. “May the mercy of Allah be upon our martyrs who sowed and watered the pure land,” said Parliament Speaker Atef Tarawneh. “We will raise our heads through the sacrifice of the young Palestinians who are still fighting in the name of the nation.”
My last few posts are missing.......
ReplyDeleteI think they are all on now, Noah. Three seemed to materialise from nowhere.
ReplyDeleteThanks
ReplyDelete